We started a conversation in another topic and it led to evolution. So I'm starting this topic so we can talk about here.
For all you Christians here who believe God created the heavens and the earth and everything in it - I'm one of you. But please... I ask you... treat those who may disagree with respect. There are other Christians who believe in evolution and I personally would like to hear their reasons. There are a lot of people here whose intelligence I respect but who disagree with me (and a lot of us) on this issue, but I would like to hear their views on it. There's no need to pounce on them or yell at them - let's just talk and see if we can all learn something!
To get the conversation started I'll repost a question that was asked in the other topic, which reflects my own questions. David Lee asked:
"Olli, I am just like Jonathan in the fact Im not gonna say you're not a Christian because you believe in evolution. I disagree with it but that doesn't mean I'm right. Lord knows I've been wrong before lol
You are a really smart guy and Im hoping you have an answer for my questions about evolution. My first problem is there is no adequate explanation for the origin of life from dead chemicals. Even the simplest life form is tremendously complex.
And the fossil record, our only documentation of whether evolution actually occurred in the past, lacks any transitional forms, and all types appear fully-formed when first present. The evidence that "pre-men" (ape-men) existed is dubious at best. So called pre-man fossils turn out to be those of apes, extinct apes, fully man, or historical frauds.
I'm lost man. Throw me a bone."
Olli, Bret and I were having a private convo so you wouldn't get upset Jon but... we actually agreed it was kind of a dead convo since no one was gonna prove the other wrong haha
But... Aiko, its funny you mention this because I was talking to Olli about it.
It's a stretch... but is it possible? Aiko, what you are talking about is known as the "theistic evolution". Some Christians believe it, but most don't because the Bible teaches us that God made all of the animals all at once and that He made man from the elements of the earth.
It talks about dinosaurs in the bible. Does it ever say that word? Nope. But the word "dragon" appears 21 times in the Old Testament alone. There goes that theory lol
All Im saying is that science looks for the proof of something. God tells us to have faith. The definition of faith is the belief in something without proof. Evolution tries to explain things... it takes the faith right out of the equation. You dont need faith anymore because we have "facts". Sounds good right?
Well "proven facts" are disproven and shown to be false on a daily basis! Just becareful you dont put your faith in science more than you are in God. Science is something of man.... science can be wrong. God is never wrong.
It sure does Carrol. It also mentions them in Psalms. "You shall tread upon the lion and adder: the young lion and the dragon shall you trample under feet" (Psalm 91:13).
From the context it is clearly speaking about a real creature that it would be impressive and intimidating to step on!
Jeremiah 51:34 tells, "he has swallowed me up like a dragon..." which brings to mind the way many carnivorous reptiles swallow their prey whole.
Both dragons of the sea (Psalm 74:13) and field (Isaiah 43:20) are mentioned.
Genesis 1:21 can best be translated: "And God created great sea monsters..." One such sea monster became sufficiently well-known to the ancients to be given the special name "Rahab" (Isaiah 51:9).
And the prophet Ezekiel likens Pharaoh to a sea monster that invaded the Nile river and stirred up the mud (32:2). The Hebrew word, "Tannin," is from the root meaning "to extend."
The language conjures up an image of a long-necked plesiosaur-like creature paddling up the river and stirring up mud from the Nile delta with its flippers. Just such a creature is depicted by the ancient Egyptians who may have netted one just as Ezekiel describes in verse 3.
I’m bull headed enough to weigh in on this one. Because my belief has always been so far outside of the question. I certainly believe that God created the heavens and the earth and everything in it. I just believe our concept of time and space is not the same as God’s so the question is pretty much un-answerable. That is, did He create them all at once or did they evolve?
There is no time and space where God dwells, so the question has no meaning. But I am not going to totally cop out on an answer. Since evolution is the one way things APPEAR to happen from our human perspective, then in that sense it CAN be a valid theory. A working model for our limited human understanding. Just so long as we do not mistake it for the TRUTH. God’s truth can only be comprehended in the Spirit.
"But the hour is coming, and now is, when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth; for the Father is seeking such to worship Him. God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth." - John 4:23-24
This group does not need me to quote Scripture, but I could not resist. Guess I’m a Bible junkie.
Not sure if I gave a straight answer, but that is my best shot.